Western: Cannonsburg SGA

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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby Bigtymer » September 9th, 2010, 5:35 pm

News flash, nobody cares!!!
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby ReidRules18 » September 9th, 2010, 7:37 pm

Not that we are here to brag and boast about lap times, but I can't believe a 25 minute lap time. I didn't think anything below 30 minutes was possible with the new reroutes as of the last couple of years.
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby G.R.XC-MTNBKR » September 9th, 2010, 8:00 pm

ReidRules18 wrote:Not that we are here to brag and boast about lap times, but I can't believe a 25 minute lap time. I didn't think anything below 30 minutes was possible with the new reroutes as of the last couple of years.

Thats because ur using common sense. :D Its not possible. Maybe with all kinds of roids and supps and $8000 superbike someone could get close. :wink: Thats why they have all those little re-routes and shortcuts so they can brag about there low times. :roll:
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby Guppie » September 9th, 2010, 10:12 pm

Maybe I'm remembering times from 2008. Sounds like that would make the most sense. This year it just feels slow, especially the first section. Not much has changed if anything this year, yet I feel slow. To brag about lap times means you have to actually do the lap time, which I'm saying I can't. Re-routes have definitely slowed the trail so I just must be thinking of a later year. Also, anybody that's ridden with me knows how much I am against those short-cuts. People cutting the corners annoying the *beep* out of me.
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby c0nsumer » September 9th, 2010, 10:42 pm

Guppie wrote:GPS distance will always be shorter than wheel magnet due to elevation changes.


Actually, it's more due to sampling rate issues. But yes, GPS rates are almost always shorter. But magnet are almost always longer because wheels compress a bit and have a marginally smaller circumference when riding as opposed to when rolling them out.

I have high hopes that newer Garmin devices that use both wheel magnet and GPS are actually able to self-calibrate properly. What'd be really nice is if they told you to ride N miles in a straight line, and then the device does what's needed to make it all accurate. But maybe that's just a pipe dream...
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby Guppie » September 9th, 2010, 11:20 pm

c0nsumer wrote:
Guppie wrote:GPS distance will always be shorter than wheel magnet due to elevation changes.


Actually, it's more due to sampling rate issues. But yes, GPS rates are almost always shorter. But magnet are almost always longer because wheels compress a bit and have a marginally smaller circumference when riding as opposed to when rolling them out.

I have high hopes that newer Garmin devices that use both wheel magnet and GPS are actually able to self-calibrate properly. What'd be really nice is if they told you to ride N miles in a straight line, and then the device does what's needed to make it all accurate. But maybe that's just a pipe dream...


Interesting, I always thought it was because on a down hill (example) gps goes as a 'crow flies' where the wheel magnet rolls down the hill and back up. Not sure if that makes sense.
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby mtb_chick » September 10th, 2010, 1:02 pm

Rode last night. Trail conditions are G-R-E-A-T great! Thanks to whomever filled in the holes (especially under the plastic mat), fixed some of the sketchy roots, and removed that tree in the rock garden. Whoever you are, I think I love you. :wink:
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby spwrozek » September 10th, 2010, 7:30 pm

fixed some of the sketchy roots


Just curious what that means? People are not dumbing down the trail are they?
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby cramer » September 11th, 2010, 7:59 am

spwrozek wrote:
fixed some of the sketchy roots


Just curious what that means? People are not dumbing down the trail are they?


Not sure what roots were fixed or how they were "fixed" however I fail to see how restoring a trail to the way it was originally could possibly be dumbing it down. Removing trail challenges that were built for that purpose, like the rock garden on section three, that would be dumbing it down. Maintaining the trail so it doesn't wash away and become a ten foot wide or 4 foot deep piece of garbage isn't dumbing it down.
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby spwrozek » September 11th, 2010, 10:30 am

I agree with you cramer, rocks and roots are part of the trail. I was just curious what was meant by "fixing some of the sketchy roots".

For example at Sharp Park in Jackson we have some guy who comes in and will cut out roots or dig a big hole off the trail to fill them in and smooth them out. These are just little roots that make the small climbs there a bit more technical. By doing what the guy did he made the trail much worse and really dumbed it down.

If it is things like that then it is crap that people do it. So I was just curious what exactly that meant.
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby cramer » September 11th, 2010, 11:17 am

spwrozek wrote:I agree with you cramer, rocks and roots are part of the trail. I was just curious what was meant by "fixing some of the sketchy roots".

For example at Sharp Park in Jackson we have some guy who comes in and will cut out roots or dig a big hole off the trail to fill them in and smooth them out. These are just little roots that make the small climbs there a bit more technical. By doing what the guy did he made the trail much worse and really dumbed it down.

If it is things like that then it is crap that people do it. So I was just curious what exactly that meant.


Understandable. There are some spots out there where the roots have gotten bad enough that people no longer ride over them but instead find another route around them, this is when the trail starts to look like garbage and when a long term fix (re-route or armoring) makes sense if for no other reason than to keep the land manager happy and help ensure our future access to the trail. It sucks that the trail sometimes ends up "easier" as a result but it's not really easier than when it was built, just easier than it was when it was in disrepair. I'm not sure how these were fixed in this situation but I agree with you that cutting them out like what you're seeing down there isn't usually a "fix" but more like a temporary band aid, not something I would ever recommend. I also agree that the trail doesn't need to be cleansed of every exposed root. My own belief is that the people riding the trail determine its future. When they start destroying the area around the trail to avoid the roots, they in effect create the need for a long term solution.

On another note, I think it's funny how many complaints there are about dumbing down the trail when a re-route is made yet I was just out there the other day and saw that the bandit line on one of the climbs where the old route had roots on it has become the ONLY line. If so many people want these challenging roots on the climb, why are there ZERO tire tracks on the old rooted line which was never blocked or re-claimed? In that area it seems despite all this root love, the riders prefer the non rooted route 100% of the time. It seems people's actions don't always coincide with their words on these forums.
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby mtb_chick » September 11th, 2010, 3:12 pm

no, no, no. relax guys. no dumbing down. just because i'm a chick, it doesn't mean i don't like roots. or rocks. btw, that rock garden is SERIOUS fun! if i had a *beep* would you still think i preferred my trails "dumbed down"?

On the serious side - there were some washed out sections from a big rainstorm a little while back that had been on the hazardous side. someone appears to have restored the roots that were washed out to pre-storm condition, not by removing them, but by repairing them (hence, "fixed some of the sketchy roots"). it's nice. and fast. and just like i remember it from before. sigh. if only it weren't raining right now...
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby G.R.XC-MTNBKR » September 11th, 2010, 5:03 pm

cramer wrote:
spwrozek wrote:I agree with you cramer, rocks and roots are part of the trail. I was just curious what was meant by "fixing some of the sketchy roots".

For example at Sharp Park in Jackson we have some guy who comes in and will cut out roots or dig a big hole off the trail to fill them in and smooth them out. These are just little roots that make the small climbs there a bit more technical. By doing what the guy did he made the trail much worse and really dumbed it down.

If it is things like that then it is crap that people do it. So I was just curious what exactly that meant.


On another note, I think it's funny how many complaints there are about dumbing down the trail when a re-route is made yet I was just out there the other day and saw that the bandit line on one of the climbs where the old route had roots on it has become the ONLY line. If so many people want these challenging roots on the climb, why are there ZERO tire tracks on the old rooted line which was never blocked or re-claimed? In that area it seems despite all this root love, the riders prefer the non rooted route 100% of the time. It seems people's actions don't always coincide with their words on these forums.

I like all the big roots it makes a already easy trail a tiny bit more technical. I never ride any of the bandit re-routes and try to block them when I have time. But ur right about one thing, once a section gets to difficult for the average rider some will try to find another way around. :evil: And once a path has been established its hard to get rid of. :(
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby spwrozek » September 11th, 2010, 6:45 pm

mtb_chick wrote:no, no, no. relax guys. no dumbing down. just because i'm a chick, it doesn't mean i don't like roots. or rocks. btw, that rock garden is SERIOUS fun! if i had a *beep* would you still think i preferred my trails "dumbed down"?

On the serious side - there were some washed out sections from a big rainstorm a little while back that had been on the hazardous side. someone appears to have restored the roots that were washed out to pre-storm condition, not by removing them, but by repairing them (hence, "fixed some of the sketchy roots"). it's nice. and fast. and just like i remember it from before. sigh. if only it weren't raining right now...


I didn't even make any connection that you were a chick.

Anyways the fixes you guys are talking about I am all for. This is a great trail and I come ride it at least 2 times a year.
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Re: Western: Cannonsburg SGA

Postby ReidRules18 » September 13th, 2010, 11:49 am

When does the game area close for biking? I know it's sometime coming up.
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