Poto: Potawatomi

For posting trail-specific conditions and problems

Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby crustaceous_flora » February 24th, 2020, 7:11 pm

Imagine saying you're a mountain biker, but you want to ride smooth flow trails with a max of -4% grade downhills with zero roots and rocks. Go ride a road bike.
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby rcab23 » February 24th, 2020, 9:02 pm

Sounds like you want to ride island lake or hines drive. Please stop making trails easier. It’s a shame we can’t make optional hard lines ANYWHERE in southeast Michigan without getting lectured.
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby Hail2Victors » February 25th, 2020, 7:46 am

So Poto is rideable then?
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby TheLoneRider » February 25th, 2020, 9:01 am

crustaceous_flora wrote:...Go ride a road bike.


Ok, I guess I do not belong here.
( I trust crustaceous_flora does not speak for PotMBA as a whole )
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby TheLoneRider » February 25th, 2020, 9:14 am

rcab23 wrote:Sounds like you want to ride island lake or hines drive. Please stop making trails easier. It’s a shame we can’t make optional hard lines ANYWHERE in southeast Michigan without getting lectured.

This attitude is why we do not have anything nice anymore
and as far as concern for your fellow trail users goes.

PotoMBA helped get the construction of the trails over
in Waterloo in motion, you got that, and still this is
the attitude?

BTW:
As nice as the DTE trails sound, the money should have gone towards
restorative work on existing trails.
Oh well, trash it an move on and then whine about how your fellow
non-mountain bike trail users some time perceive the mountain bike
community as having a poor reputation .
Nonetheless, I truly hope DTE proves to be a reference design and
implementation for the future of our trails.
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby batgirl1 » February 25th, 2020, 10:02 am

Silly me.....I keep thinking this is the posts for trail conditions.
"If life was easy, where would all the adventure be?"

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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby SteveF » February 25th, 2020, 10:55 am

I don't know how long you've been riding or how familiar you are with trail access issues and history. But various groups and individuals have been trying to get mtb'ers banned or denied access to trails for decades, practically since the sport was introduced. Though it may not be your intent to troll it sure looks like you are; I can see why folks would take your suggestions that way.
Sometimes the squeaky wheel gets replaced.
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby DynoDon » February 25th, 2020, 11:05 am

SteveF wrote:I don't know how long you've been riding or how familiar you are with trail access issues and history. But various groups and individuals have been trying to get mtb'ers banned or denied access to trails for decades, practically since the sport was introduced. Though it may not be your intent to troll it sure looks like you are; I can see why folks would take your suggestions that way.


Trolling while fishing is putting bait out for prey to BITE, stop biting the bait, and the Troller can't catch you...
When was the first bicycle race?
When the second one was built !!!
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby SteveF » February 25th, 2020, 11:37 am

DynoDon wrote:
SteveF wrote:I don't know how long you've been riding or how familiar you are with trail access issues and history. But various groups and individuals have been trying to get mtb'ers banned or denied access to trails for decades, practically since the sport was introduced. Though it may not be your intent to troll it sure looks like you are; I can see why folks would take your suggestions that way.


Trolling while fishing is putting bait out for prey to BITE, stop biting the bait, and the Troller can't catch you...


Yes I'm aware. I'm taking the guy at face value that he doesn't intend to troll and explaining to him why it might seem that he is.
Sometimes the squeaky wheel gets replaced.
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby i69whitey » February 25th, 2020, 12:19 pm

Leroi Brown wrote:I smell a troll.

Mr. Brown knows.
Who else would have this to say? Besides maybe Vandeman?

"So the real solution for trails of the like
the contributors to this thread appear to prefer
to ride on, would be for a private mountain bike
park.

A park where trail conditions can be fabricated
to meet the desired conditions where those who
prefer to ride on said trails can pay the real cost
for the privilege to do so.

Thus giving the trails under the public trust a break
from the damage wheeled travel over them causes."
"...So whether you have got 29-, 26- or 20-inch wheels, whether you ride XC or DH, whether you've got boobs or balls, i hear you. Let's go ride." - Rachel Atherton
"Ride your bike, sleep when your dead." - dirt
http://thehubofdetroit.org/
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby mtbdudex » February 25th, 2020, 4:52 pm

All I got to say about the recent discussion by the lone rider ...
Image

Is his name reminded me of this song
Image

FWIW, I’ve been riding Poto since 1995, it’s my favorite trail still ..


Sent from my iPhone 11Pro using Tapatalk
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby TheLoneRider » February 26th, 2020, 9:21 am

batgirl1 wrote:Silly me.....I keep thinking this is the posts for trail conditions.

Adverse soil erosion has nothing to do with trail conditions?
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby TheLoneRider » February 26th, 2020, 9:33 am

mtbdudex wrote:All I got to say about the recent discussion by the lone rider ...
Image

Is his name reminded me of this song
Image

FWIW, I’ve been riding Poto since 1995, it’s my favorite trail still ..

Sent from my iPhone 11Pro using Tapatalk


And how does this part of your post add positively to the discussion?

You seem more interested in the individual than the discussion?

Does the number of posts a user has have anything to do with their validity?

Great song by the way,
would it be possible to change my handle?

mtbdudex wrote:FWIW, I’ve been riding Poto since 1995, it’s my favorite trail still ..

Sent from my iPhone 11Pro using Tapatalk

What condition was the trail like back in those days?

Sincerest regards,
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby Paul Brown » February 26th, 2020, 10:17 am

Water does far more damage than any user group (sans the EQ's or motorized vehicles). Poto is old school fall line design except for the reroutes. Anybody who thinks mtb's caused the 8 foot deep trenches which used to be single track is mistaken.
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Re: Poto: Potawatomi

Postby TheLoneRider » February 26th, 2020, 11:11 am

SteveF wrote:[
Yes I'm aware. I'm taking the guy at face value that he doesn't intend to troll and explaining to him why it might seem that he is.

Thank you,
you seem to be one of the more perceptive members of the group
who is able to look past their "baggage" and give benefit of the doubt
versus the conclusions most every one else immediately is jumping to.

With that said, I do not intend to become your friend by joining what
appears to be an PotMBA/MMBA echo chamber. While it is obviously
a sensitive issue, it is an issue that did not crop up over night and
such issues generally tend to be very difficult to remedy.

I see DTE as a step in a positive direction, but I have mixed feelings.

( I did not participate in the DTE project, so IDK, maybe all of the below
. was already considered )

An excellent opportunity was missed to help change the perception of
the "MTB community" as being nothing but a sort of a "chain gang" and
more towards stewards of trails. ( I do not appreciate some of the looks
I get from other trail users while out trail riding, do you? I'd like to help
impact that in a positive way -- that is even why I am taking any of
my time to bother to communicate with you all, though largely all
that has come back is something to the effect, "don't let this troll
waste your time", as well beginnings of insults / evidence that
doxing is more important than the discussion, i.e. tactics indicative
of bullying type attitudes )

As awesome of an accomplishment DTE / Waterloo is ( and by PotMBA's
help ), I am left feeling half slighted as I am sure ( whether or not they
are fully consciously aware) your root cutters over in Pinckney do.

It occurs to me, why wasn't the money raised by the foundation used
for restoration (of the existing lines / easy lines) and expansion (intermediate
and challenging lines) on the "Poto" (for example ).

Some project more along those lines opens up a world of positive outcomes.

How do you think you root cutter would feel, would react if they saw your
efforts resulting in the soil being restored over those exposed roots, if the
trail's crown would have been restored?

Perhaps if it were a cross country skier of whom was previously getting
knocked down or their ski bases were getting ruined because of those roots,
would they be tempted to cut roots, or would you now have made a potential
ally?

What about those pesky hikers (including that 65 year old that can not lift there feet
over the 4" root) that are always in your way, ruining your hard and fast lines, you
know, the ones you practically run over all the time, another potential ally if the
"Poto" was mindfully restored and upgraded.

If in fact all of the different trail users could all become allies, think of the potential
for fund raising, volunteer work, etc...

Nonetheless, I fully appreciate what DTE accomplished in terms of reducing trail use
conflicts and I look forward to one day making it out that way for some pedaling.

Also,
I'm guessing you are one willing to take on more responsibility as it is my
guess that you are the Steve mentioned earlier in the thread to
be some doing survey work on the "Poto"?
If so, thanks again.

Well, whatever the case, I hope whatever path the PotoMBA / MMBA
/ MTB Community decides to follow does not get me banned from riding
any trail I should stumble upon and would like to ride in the future.

Best Regards,
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